chavez

[redarmyfaction38]

there is a campaign to remove the two term presidency in order to allow chavez to be re elected.
i have a question, what merit does a "proletarian" party have, if it relies so heavily on the re election of a president in order to carry through the "socialist revolution"?
doesn't this campaign/referendum just reinforce bourgeouis notions of leaders and leadership? and the inability of workers to organise and lead society?
surely, the programme of chavez party should be enough to ensure re election of its representative.

[OneNamedNameLess]

I think the movement is too dependant on Chavez as a leader. This has been highlighted in the past as a concern. However, the last referendum proposed to grant more power to the proletariat and increase workers control across the country and was voted against.

I think it is worthwhile to note that workers in Venezuela have organised themselves efficiently in the past few years. A good example of this is the many cooperatives which have emerged during the reign of Chavez.

[bailey_187]

there is a campaign to remove the two term presidency in order to allow chavez to be re elected.
i have a question, what merit does a "proletarian" party have, if it relies so heavily on the re election of a president in order to carry through the "socialist revolution"?
doesn't this campaign/referendum just reinforce bourgeouis notions of leaders and leadership? and the inability of workers to organise and lead society?
surely, the programme of chavez party should be enough to ensure re election of its representative.

So what do you propose as an alternative?

Guerrilla warfare, mass worker uprisings? :rolleyes:


The Bolivarian revolutions major weakness is its dependency on Chavez but hey, hes a strong leader with strong support

[OneNamedNameLess]

So what do you propose as an alternative?

Guerrilla warfare, mass worker uprisings? :rolleyes:


The Bolivarian revolutions major weakness is its dependency on Chavez but hey, hes a strong leader with strong support

Yeah, Chavez has gained too much weight for Guerrilla warfare now :lol:

Every movement has it's weaknesses. The significant factor in Chavez's case is that he has consistently addressed the needs of the poor from the outset of his presidency.

[bailey_187]

Yeah, Chavez has gained too much weight for Guerrilla warfare now :lol:

Every movement has it's weaknesses. The significant factor in Chavez's case is that he has consistently addressed the needs of the poor from the outset of his presidency.

LOL, not only has he got fatter, his face seems to have got fatter too. look at the 1992 coup video, weird.

Adressing the needs of the poor? Rediculous! who cares about that. Socialism is about theoretizing, making up new 'isms and dreaming of a mass uprising, not addressing the needs of the poor.

[OneNamedNameLess]

LOL, not only has he got fatter, his face seems to have got fatter too. look at the 1992 coup video, weird.

Adressing the needs of the poor? Rediculous! who cares about that. Socialism is about theoretizing, making up new 'isms and dreaming of a mass uprising, not addressing the needs of the poor.

:laugh: Agreed. His face has totally changed.

I care about that. The majority of the country are poor. A so called socialist president should address the needs of the masses in his country. The poor in Venezuela are the proletariat. As a result it is Chavez's responsibilty to support the poor in every way possible.

[OneNamedNameLess]

Sorry but the last sentence in your post is a little silly.

Socialism is not about making up new isms whatever that means. Chavez is not just dreaming of a mass uprising. He has involved the masses in his fight against the ruling classes of the country.

[el_chavista]

There have been a discussion among Morenoites on supporting ("trotsko-chavistas") or confronting ("trotsko-escuálidos") a petty-bourgeois nationalist like Chávez.

In combating Chávez's "Bonapartism", the trotsko-escuálidos share the rightwing opposition against the Bolivarian movement.

The trotsko-chavistas say that Chávez's Bonapartism is progressive in that he brings the workers to his side in confronting the transnational capital.

Unfortunately, there doesn´t seem to be any real revolutionary cadre in the PSUV to replace Chávez.

[FreeFocus]

Sorry but the last sentence in your post is a little silly.

Socialism is not about making up new isms whatever that means. Chavez is not just dreaming of a mass uprising. He has involved the masses in his fight against the ruling classes of the country.

Someone is terrible at detecting sarcasm, lol.

I basically agree with what others have noted, that things are too dependent on Chavez, but that he has delivered a number of things. The danger is that Venezuela may jump too far into authoritarian leftism.

[bailey_187]

Sorry but the last sentence in your post is a little silly.

Socialism is not about making up new isms whatever that means. Chavez is not just dreaming of a mass uprising. He has involved the masses in his fight against the ruling classes of the country.

:laugh: it was sarcasm, man

[OneNamedNameLess]

:laugh: it was sarcasm, man

:blushing:

Just fished out my dictionary and found it! That's interesting :lol:

[KC]

Unfortunately, there doesn´t seem to be any real revolutionary cadre in the PSUV to replace Chávez.

That's because they are expelled from the party if they criticize him.