"Brainwashing"

[LeninBalls]

Since we're supposed to have educated generations into being "good humans", not being greedy is cool and working for the benefit of the commune=yes, right? Isn't that essentially brainwashing? Making people believe our way of life (yes I know it is a good way of life and why would you want to be greedy etc but nonetheless its still enforcing our thoughts onto them)?

Then one can say, "But is it so wrong to tell a child that if they want something more than others they'll have it at the expense of say 3 others?"

What if the child says "Not my fucking problem"? You can't say to the kid "DONT BE GREEDY YOU ASSHOLE SIT DOWN AND LEARN HOW TO SHARE".

A person should be able to do what they like, right?

:confused:

[Invincible Summer]

The term "brainwashing" is usually used to refer to a systematic manipulation of a person's belief system by way of instilling thoughts/beliefs into a person that are contradictory to their normal set of beliefs, using psychological techniques.

Anarchists/Communists are not forcing our beliefs onto others. We don't drive around in vans, kidnapping random people on the street and bringing them to a secret location so we can tie them down and make them watch propaganda films.

You can't force people into becoming revolutionaries. It's the same as having "top-down" Communism (that is, some high officials - say a national party - saying, "Okay, it's Communism from now on). People have to want to liberate themselves.

So in a way, you're right - people should be able to do what they like. But what Anarchists and Communists want to do is educate people as to what the capitalist system is all about, so that the people would like to overthrow the system.

[LeninBalls]

I still don't see what's wrong with educating humans about the flaws of the capitalist system and greediness, but to some it's a problem. We can say that people are greedy because we're born into greedy societies, so when the society isn't greedy people aren't born greedy! Whee!

The problem is making this society not greedy and there will always be people who want more than others, there will be people who will disagree and we can't just tell them they're wrong (even though they are :)) and to learn our way of belief.

How aren't we forcing our beliefs onto others? We may not be forcing them per se, but, we are telling them what we think is right and if they think too far opposite of us they're wrong.

[Kassad]

Education and organization to promote an ideology isn't brainwashing. I mean, what do the bourgeoisie do with our children? They raise them in a monetary system where profit is supreme and you get bigger, better, more efficient things when they "contribute" to society, which is synonymous with "trample your fellow workers." People are raised in a sick society and as Jiddu Krishnamurti says, "it is no measure of health to be well-adjusted to a sick society." That's very true, since the greed and corruption is a direct result of demented conditioning. The status of society is what raises people into corruptness and greed. If everyone was able to aquire their necessities, these vices would be irrelevant and non-existent.

If a child is raised with everything he requires, why would he ask for anything more? And if he did, is that so terrible? Under a revolutionary socialist economy, the immense wealth created from the destruction of surplus value and bourgeoisie manipulation, there is no reason everyone cannot have what they desire. Instead of spending money on executive pay, the military-industrial complex and manipulation, why not spend that money providing necessities? The idea that people will not get what they desire in a socialist society is merely propaganda.

[Rangi]

I think that all behaviour is learned. Children are sponges and through sight, listening and emulation their behaviour patterns are developed.

I teach children and have had such circumstances as a child that doesn't want to share. It is up to that child to decide on whether to share the resource in question or not. It is also up to that child to deal with the social repercussions of not sharing; such as alienating other members of his/her peerage.

[Charles Xavier]

brainwashing is a cool idea in many sci-fi movies.

[Black Dagger]

Since we're supposed to have educated generations into being "good humans", not being greedy is cool and working for the benefit of the commune=yes, right? Isn't that essentially brainwashing?'

No, it's not brainwashing to advocate a point of view or perspective.

Brainwashing entails the manipulation or coercion of an individual into adopting a point of view or perspective.

Can you see the difference?



Making people believe our way of life (yes I know it is a good way of life and why would you want to be greedy etc but nonetheless its still enforcing our thoughts onto them)?

Yes that would be brainwashing, but what you're describe is not something that communist do or advocate - what gave you that idea?



What if the child says "Not my fucking problem"? You can't say to the kid "DONT BE GREEDY YOU ASSHOLE SIT DOWN AND LEARN HOW TO SHARE".

Well no - i wouldn't yell and swear at the child - but yes, sharing is something that all children need to learn at some point - i don't see how or why anyone would disagree with that?



A person should be able to do what they like, right?

No, that is libertarianism. Communism advocate personal freedom, but no person is 'free' to impinge upon the freedom of others. You're not 'free' to exploit someones labour, to enslave, to rape or assault.

[thinkerOFthoughts]

Look at it this way, what we do is pretty much "open" their eyes, show them the light (very christian terms right their!!:lol:) we dont force them into following but we provide them with the light of truth, and then encourage them to act on it.

[Black Dagger]

I disagree.

Communists don't 'spread the light of truth' - we encourage dissent - critical thought.

[thinkerOFthoughts]

well maybe "light of truth" wasn't a good phrase.

[Black Dagger]

Sure, but i was objecting to the idea behind your comment - rather than just the words you chose to express it. What i mean is our task as communists is not to spread a specific knowledge or truth but to draw a critical light on the world - on exploitation and oppression - on the state and it's police, on capitalism and it's wage system and so on. Unless people come to these conclusions through their own critical thinking they will not be communists but sheep and we would be no more than missionaries.