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Metternich
8th February 2009, 07:03
Discrimination is a fundamental aspect of nature and of success. Every day we discriminate in every single choice we make, simply by preferring one option over another. This is a necessity, given the fact that time is finite. Economists call this the ‘opportunity cost.’ For each choice we make, there is a chosen choice, and an unchosen choice. Therefore, all (discriminatory) acts are logically acts of positive discrimination and negative discrimination. However, every decision we make is made on the basis that our decisions will benefit us the most. This applies to our dealings with other people, as well.
Western Man is the direct result of thousands of years of discrimination; of discrimination in breeding habits, in marriage, and in cultural relations among other individuals and tribes. Western Man is the direct result of the principle of divergence. There was a time when every single province in Europe was home to a unique language, and a unique tribal identity. The principle of divergence has only continued up to a certain point, however.
Since the French Revolution, the principle of divergence has waned, as its opposite, the principle of convergence, has waxed. Culture, language, and tribal relations have become homogenized, and continue to become more and more so, as we speak.
Today, in our postmodern age, the only enshrined principle is that there are no principles, and the only sin is discrimination (specifically, that of preferring those similar to us over those who are dissimilar). Naturalistically speaking, we are truly living in an extremely dark age!
If we accept the proposition that our current value system does not condone discrimination (and there are certainly enough laws to make this claim!), we must proceed to question why that is the case, or more precisely qui bono? Who benefits from this fact?
The answer is, of course, those with the most power (as is always the case in society), and who has the most power? We should immediately know that in a capitalist society the individuals with the most power are the individuals with the most money. Now, in order to proceed, my dear reader, we must simply deduce who has the most money, and it does not take a genius to realize immediately that it is the Multinational Corporations.
So why do these corporations support ideas that come from the cultural left such as multiculturalism, feminism, and homosexuality?
It is simply this: profit. Multiculturalism increases profits because it lowers wage rates, feminism increases profits because in brings women into the workplace and turns them into consumers, and homosexuality is desirable because gay men have no children to feed, and therefore more money to purchase on vanity items.
Corporations care most about profits. This is a simple fact. But they are running a huge risk. Just as corporations wish to increase immigration (in order to lower wages by increasing the qualitative amount of eligible workers in the labor pool) so do politicians wish to profit off the new immigrants from their votes. Nowadays politicians buy votes with promises, and promises invariably mean spending money, however politicians collect money in the opposite way as the corporations do: they take it, instead of make it. Therefore, the middle class is automatically squeezed from both ends: from the wage-lowering mechanisms of mass immigration to the substantial taxation hikes of the welfare state that inevitably increases along with immigration.
Therefore, we can deduce that the very powerful from both the public and private sectors will desire to increase immigration, given the incentives of our current system. The aggregate losers, however, are the working, taxpaying citizens. Therefore, it is no doubt that we are getting poorer, and that jobs are getting harder to come by, while our taxes are being raised.
So why isn’t this issue being addressed? Well, those who claim to represent us are not representing us by taking what is ours and giving it to others. That is for sure. The issue is not being addressed, simply because the powerful forces of globalization have made it a taboo subject, be it that by doing so it protects their own perceived best interests.
Allow me to quote the eminent economist, Thomas Sowell, on the matter:


“The media and the intelligentsia love to say that most immigrants, from whatever group, are good people. But what "most" people from a given country are like is irrelevant.
If 85 percent of group A are fine people and 95 percent of group B are fine people, that means you are going to be importing three times as many undesirables when you let in people from Group A.
Citizen-of-the-world types are resistant to the idea of tightening our borders, and especially resistant to the idea of making a distinction between people from different countries. But the real problem is not their self-righteous fetishes but the fact that they have intimidated so many other people into silence.
In the current climate of political correctness it is taboo even to mention facts that go against the rosy picture of immigrants -- for example, the fact that Russia and Nigeria are always listed among the most corrupt countries on earth, and that Russian and Nigerian immigrants in the United States have already established patterns of crime well known to law enforcement but kept from the public by the mainstream media.
Self-preservation used to be called the first law of nature. But today self-preservation has been superseded by a need to preserve the prevailing rhetoric and visions.”

Now the elites are running a tight gambit. The elites are capitalists, members of one class. They are using ‘the masses,’ another class to create a desired outcome, and they are using the engines of mass democracy to do this.
There is, however, a risk that they are taking: that the mob could actually take over and destroy business interests, in favor of wealth redistribution. This is a common phenomenon in this day and age. It has happened in Zimbabwe, in South Africa, in Venezuela, and in Bolivia. Given demographic trends it will probably be occurring in America and in Europe within the present decade.
When mass wealth confiscation occurs, the very wealthy will try to hide their wealth and transfer it to other safe havens, but without a civilization of their own, the wealthy will have less and less options for potential growth, and without working protestants, there can be no protestant work ethic. This implies that a society devoid of a stable middle class that has a stake in the system, the rich will not be able to hold on to their wealth.
The current zeitgeist is best summarized by Pr. Noam Chomsky:

“Capitalism is not fundamentally racist -- it can exploit racism for its purposes, but racism isn't built into it. Capitalism basically wants people to be interchangeable cogs, and differences among them, such as on the basis of race, usually are not functional. I mean, they may be functional for a period, like if you want a super exploited workforce or something, but those situations are kind of anomalous. Over the long term, you can expect capitalism to be anti-racist -- just because its anti-human. And race is in fact a human characteristic -- there's no reason why it should be a negative characteristic, but it is a human characteristic. So therefore identifications based on race interfere with the basic ideal that people should be available just as consumers and producers, interchangeable cogs who will purchase all the junk that's produced -- that's their ultimate function, and any other properties they might have are kind of irrelevant, and usually a nuisance.”
But the idea that consumption can unite people enough to create a cohesive and stable ground for investing purposes is tenuous. Tribal and ethnic conflict destabilizes business, and tribal conflict exists everywhere around the world where several self-identified groups exist under the same government. It is only logical that these groups will unite within their own tribe to maximize gains via the wealth redistributive channels of the public sector.
These trends are crystallizing right now in the United States.
According to CNN exist polls in the 2008 presidential elections, non-European Americans cast their votes for the Democratic (wealth redistributor) nominee 79%-18%. Blacks voted for Obama by a 94%-1% margin!
European Americans exhibited similar block-voting preferences in heavily diverse areas such as Alabama, where they voted for McCain 88%-10%.
Simply put, there are those who make wealth, and there are those who take wealth. The two groups are naturally at odds with each other, and conflict is what happens when equality-of-outcome (socialism) is preached from the pulpit of every established institution in the land, while the majority of people believe in equality-of-opportunity.
Egalitarianism rules through envy; constant, red-hot envy. In order to put out this unholy fire, a return to tradition is required. This implies hierarchy. Hierarchy based on the natural qualities within man’s being.
A return to traditional values would mean more stability for moneyed-institutions, and more happiness for the (essentially already traditional) families that comprise Western Civilization.
This means acceptance of churches, of traditional, wholesome values, and a return to a culture of self-sufficient people.
It is the social security system and other aspects of the welfare state that has turned the pillar of Western Civilization into the upside-down pyramid of today’s social values. Our ancestors survived for millennia without such a contrivance, and are now reaping the rewards of it: mass unemployment (due to artificially high minimum wage standards), the breakdown of the family (as children are now an economic liability, instead of a an economic asset), and of course the magnet-like pull of millions, if not billions of poor, third-world immigrants that wish to live off the entitlement system.
Immigration cannot keep the welfare state alive forever, but it can essentially dissolve the bonds of indigenous European people-hood that has organically developed for thousands of years. Therefore the social security system should be slowly phased-out of existence (without harming those who have already paid into it), and the young should be allowed to return to live in an organic environment based on identity and tradition, as their forefathers enjoyed.
This is a basic human right. An empire of violence and coercion is a cancer, not a legitimate nation. Such is the price of multiculturalism. The intellectual forefather of this weltanschauung was the learned philosopher Johann Gottfried von Herder, who stated in 1784 that:

"Nature brings forth families; the most natural state therefore is also one people, with a national character of its own. For a people is as much a plant of nature as is a family, except that it has more branches. Nothing therefore seems more contradictory to the true end of governments than the endless expansion of states, the wild confusion of races and nations under one scepter. An empire made up of a hundred peoples and 120 provinces which have been forced together is a monstrosity, not a state-body."
The Holy Roman Empire was the direct result of organic human ties, united by the rite of the Emperor. They were not taxed to the high degree that we are today, they did not work half the year in order to pay the government to redistribute their own wealth. They did not have enforced fraternity shoved down their throats as we do today. They were comparatively richer than we are; we, the true serfs of the ages.
When I am talking of riches, I mean spiritual riches. The utility of money runs into diminishing returns, which means that money cannot buy happiness. Happiness is created by strong, healthy kin-relations according to the modern social sciences.
We must reestablish our organic kin-ties in order to revitalize our civilization. This is a basic human right, recognized by the United Nations, which states that: "Indigenous peoples have the right to determine their own identity or membership in accordance with their customs and traditions."
The process of Western capitulation is degrading to both Westerners and non-Westerners alike. It treats one side as the weak-willed parent, and the other as the spoilt child. This is improper behavior between civilizations. The West will become respected only once it makes itself respectable.

turquino
8th February 2009, 08:02
I'm not going to make a detailed criticism of this copy and paste because this topic will probably be trashed before I can finish for being racist new right garbage. There is, however, something worth understanding, and that's the appropriation of populist anti-corporate rhetoric with indigenous essentialism to complement old fashioned fascist politics. This is volkisch, blood and soil ideology, just updated for new readers. There's something to be learned here though, I think leftists should keep in mind whose ideas they're really representing when they attack 'multi-national corporations' and 'globalization' because those strategies can often backfire and work against anti-capitalists by endorsing right-wing extremism.

Metternich
8th February 2009, 19:57
I'm not going to make a detailed criticism of this copy and paste because this topic will probably be trashed before I can finish for being racist new right garbage. There is, however, something worth understanding, and that's the appropriation of populist anti-corporate rhetoric with indigenous essentialism to complement old fashioned fascist politics. This is volkisch, blood and soil ideology, just updated for new readers. There's something to be learned here though, I think leftists should keep in mind whose ideas they're really representing when they attack 'multi-national corporations' and 'globalization' because those strategies can often backfire and work against anti-capitalists by endorsing right-wing extremism.

You can put the article where ever you like, however, it is all the more proof that 'fascist' is any idea that your worldview is incapable of dealing with.

Therefore Noam Chomsky's view in this article becomes 'fascist.'

Despite the fact that fascism is a dead interwar period ideology, it is propped up along with other superficial labels to keep your worldview alive (despite the reality that you are helping promote the agendas of the corporations).

TheCultofAbeLincoln
9th February 2009, 03:46
Discrimination is a fundamental aspect of nature and of success.

Uh, Germany lost. America, with all its Jazz music, won.


Every day we discriminate in every single choice we make, simply by preferring one option over another. This is a necessity, given the fact that time is finite. Economists call this the ‘opportunity cost.’ For each choice we make, there is a chosen choice, and an unchosen choice. Therefore, all (discriminatory) acts are logically acts of positive discrimination and negative discrimination. However, every decision we make is made on the basis that our decisions will benefit us the most. This applies to our dealings with other people, as well.Well, yes. A cute girl is going to get more attention than an ugly girl.


Western Man is the direct result of thousands of years of discrimination; of discrimination in breeding habits, in marriage, and in cultural relations among other individuals and tribes. Western Man is the direct result of the principle of divergence.My people (Irish, Italian, German) left because of this crap "thinking". And now I'm 100% American. Know what else, I'm proud of my background and glad that once my ancestors got here they intermingled instead of holding on to old-world views.


There was a time when every single province in Europe was home to a unique language, and a unique tribal identity.There was a time when it was (at least in the West) ruled by Caesar.

Then it divided up into many small fiefdoms.

This is called the medieval period or, as we in America say, the Shittle Ages.


The principle of divergence has only continued up to a certain point, however.Really?


Since the French Revolution, the principle of divergence has waned, as its opposite, the principle of convergence, has waxed. Culture, language, and tribal relations have become homogenized, and continue to become more and more so, as we speak.Yes, it's a great thing we can speak to each other, am I right?

You can't believe how distraught I'd be if we all lived in little tribes and spoke different languages so we couldn't have this conversation.


If we accept the proposition that our current value system does not condone discrimination (and there are certainly enough laws to make this claim!), we must proceed to question why that is the case, or more precisely qui bono? Who benefits from this fact?People who don't like being discriminated against due to race, sexual orientation, religion, or creed. In other words, people who don't like getting persecuted for bullshit.


The answer is, of course, those with the most power (as is always the case in society), and who has the most power? We should immediately know that in a capitalist society the individuals with the most power are the individuals with the most money. Now, in order to proceed, my dear reader, we must simply deduce who has the most money, and it does not take a genius to realize immediately that it is the Multinational Corporations.
So why do these corporations support ideas that come from the cultural left such as multiculturalism, feminism, and homosexuality?
It is simply this: profit. Multiculturalism increases profits because it lowers wage rates, feminism increases profits because in brings women into the workplace and turns them into consumers, and homosexuality is desirable because gay men have no children to feed, and therefore more money to purchase on vanity items. I've been arguing this for a long time, that Capitalism does away with discrimination by its very nature.

Though we consider this to be progressive.


Corporations care most about profits. This is a simple fact. But they are running a huge risk. Just as corporations wish to increase immigration (in order to lower wages by increasing the qualitative amount of eligible workers in the labor pool) so do politicians wish to profit off the new immigrants from their votes. Nowadays politicians buy votes with promises, and promises invariably mean spending money, however politicians collect money in the opposite way as the corporations do: they take it, instead of make it. Therefore, the middle class is automatically squeezed from both ends: from the wage-lowering mechanisms of mass immigration to the substantial taxation hikes of the welfare state that inevitably increases along with immigration.
Therefore, we can deduce that the very powerful from both the public and private sectors will desire to increase immigration, given the incentives of our current system. The aggregate losers, however, are the working, taxpaying citizens. Therefore, it is no doubt that we are getting poorer, and that jobs are getting harder to come by, while our taxes are being raised.Then why is America #1 in the economy?

We are, after all, a country built almost entirely on immigration.


Allow me to quote the eminent economist, Thomas Sowell, on the matter:
“The media and the intelligentsia love to say that most immigrants, from whatever group, are good people. But what "most" people from a given country are like is irrelevant.
If 85 percent of group A are fine people and 95 percent of group B are fine people, that means you are going to be importing three times as many undesirables when you let in people from Group A.
Citizen-of-the-world types are resistant to the idea of tightening our borders, and especially resistant to the idea of making a distinction between people from different countries. But the real problem is not their self-righteous fetishes but the fact that they have intimidated so many other people into silence.
In the current climate of political correctness it is taboo even to mention facts that go against the rosy picture of immigrants -- for example, the fact that Russia and Nigeria are always listed among the most corrupt countries on earth, and that Russian and Nigerian immigrants in the United States have already established patterns of crime well known to law enforcement but kept from the public by the mainstream media.
Self-preservation used to be called the first law of nature. But today self-preservation has been superseded by a need to preserve the prevailing rhetoric and visions."
Every group of immigrants have been involved with crime and corruption. It's nothing new. Perhaps I should redirect you to some info on Italian Mafiosi in the US? Irish? Mexican? Aryan? Black? Someone else?

And like I said earlier, almost everyone in America is a descendant of an immigrant, so this idea that immigration is the cause of our problems is absurd (though not if you're Native American).

It'd be like saying "eating food is the number one cause of indigestion."


Now the elites are running a tight gambit. The elites are capitalists, members of one class. They are using ‘the masses,’ another class to create a desired outcome, and they are using the engines of mass democracy to do this.
There is, however, a risk that they are taking: that the mob could actually take over and destroy business interests, in favor of wealth redistribution. This is a common phenomenon in this day and age. It has happened in Zimbabwe, in South Africa, in Venezuela, and in Bolivia. Given demographic trends it will probably be occurring in America and in Europe within the present decade.Please explain how communists will be taking over in America due to demographic trends.


When mass wealth confiscation occurs, the very wealthy will try to hide their wealth and transfer it to other safe havens, but without a civilization of their own, the wealthy will have less and less options for potential growth, and without working protestants, there can be no protestant work ethic.Oh please.



But the idea that consumption can unite people enough to create a cohesive and stable ground for investing purposes is tenuous. Tribal and ethnic conflict destabilizes business, and tribal conflict exists everywhere around the world where several self-identified groups exist under the same government. It is only logical that these groups will unite within their own tribe to maximize gains via the wealth redistributive channels of the public sector.
Ethnic tension is the destroyer of countries and brings on economic ruin.


These trends are crystallizing right now in the United States.
According to CNN exist polls in the 2008 presidential elections, non-European Americans cast their votes for the Democratic (wealth redistributor) nominee 79%-18%. Blacks voted for Obama by a 94%-1% margin!
European Americans exhibited similar block-voting preferences in heavily diverse areas such as Alabama, where they voted for McCain 88%-10%.
Simply put, there are those who make wealth, and there are those who take wealth. The two groups are naturally at odds with each other, and conflict is what happens when equality-of-outcome (socialism) is preached from the pulpit of every established institution in the land, while the majority of people believe in equality-of-opportunity. hahahahahahaha Alabama white are the makers of wealth hahahaha


Egalitarianism rules through envy; constant, red-hot envy. In order to put out this unholy fire, a return to tradition is required. This implies hierarchy. Hierarchy based on the natural qualities within man’s being.No, it's based on a lack of thinking.


A return to traditional values would mean more stability for moneyed-institutions, and more happiness for the (essentially already traditional) families that comprise Western Civilization."Woman, shut the fuck up and make me my sandwhich! yeah, I gotta smack her around a bit but she learns."


This means acceptance of churches, of traditional, wholesome values, and a return to a culture of self-sufficient people.
Are churches not accepted where you live?


Our ancestors survived for millennia without such a contrivance, and are now reaping the rewards of it: mass unemployment (due to artificially high minimum wage standards), Most of our ancestors were slaves to the land of a Lord or King (many until they had the wisdom to ditch that continent).


the breakdown of the family (as children are now an economic liability, instead of a an economic asset),Yes, unlike bangladesh nobody needs 20 kids in order to live past 50 anymore.


Immigration cannot keep the welfare state alive forever, but it can essentially dissolve the bonds of indigenous European people-hood that has organically developed for thousands of years.GOOD! IT'S ABOUT FUCKING TIME!!!

I know this may be a bit of a shock, but there is nothing special about your culture being "pure". Ye Europeans have been squabbling with each other over bullshit ethnic lines since the dawn of time, but it's time to grow up. We're in the 21st Century now.

It's a good thing you're not the establishment. I'd be worried Americans and Russians would once again have to free people from this stupidity.


Therefore the social security system should be slowly phased-out of existence (without harming those who have already paid into it), and the young should be allowed to return to live in an organic environment based on identity and tradition, as their forefathers enjoyed.Once again, are you talking about the 90% whose forefathers were serfs?


This is a basic human right. An empire of violence and coercion is a cancer, not a legitimate nation. Such is the price of multiculturalism. The intellectual forefather of this weltanschauung was the learned philosopher Johann Gottfried von Herder, who stated in 1784 that:

"Nature brings forth families; the most natural state therefore is also one people, with a national character of its own. For a people is as much a plant of nature as is a family, except that it has more branches. Nothing therefore seems more contradictory to the true end of governments than the endless expansion of states, the wild confusion of races and nations under one scepter. An empire made up of a hundred peoples and 120 provinces which have been forced together is a monstrosity, not a state-bodyNature brings forth pigs; the most natural meal therefore is one of bacon.


The process of Western capitulation is degrading to both Westerners and non-Westerners alike. It treats one side as the weak-willed parent, and the other as the spoilt child. This is improper behavior between civilizations. The West will become respected only once it makes itself respectable.First, as we move from an Atlantic-centric to a Pacific-centered world euro man will lose influence, you are correct.

Second, the west is the most prosperous area on the planet. Who exactly do we need respect from?

Metternich
9th February 2009, 19:06
Yes, pretty girls do get more attention, tall/coordinated people are better at basketball, High IQ people are better at math, etc.

Everyone is NOT created equal, but extremely unequal, and therefore equality of outcome is in direct contradiction of equality of opportunity.

If ethnic tension destroys countries, as you admit, then a multicultural society should not be the aim of any country that wishes to remain alive.

True diversity means divergence instead of convergence, the latter is Stalinism, and if we can afford to keep alive animal diversity (endangered species) then we should also be able to afford to keep alive human diversity (languages, phenotypes, etc) simply by not coercing people into unnatural situations of multiculturalism as Americans did to the Indians, and as as multinational corporations are now doing to peaceful countries such as Poland, Sweden, and Ireland.

TheCultofAbeLincoln
10th February 2009, 05:33
Yes, pretty girls do get more attention, tall/coordinated people are better at basketball, High IQ people are better at math, etc.

Everyone is NOT created equal, but extremely unequal, and therefore equality of outcome is in direct contradiction of equality of opportunity

True, as long as everyone, despite race/looks/IQ, enjoys the same political and legal rights as everyone else.

Or do the strong have a natural right to dominate the weak?


If ethnic tension destroys countries, as you admit, then a multicultural society should not be the aim of any country that wishes to remain alive.Well, no. People simply shouldn't think with a tribal mentality.

You say corporations cause the ethnic tension, but the vast majority of multi-national corps make much more money in countries in which there is no ethnic conflict. For example, investing in Dubai is considered safer than doing so in Beirut.

Conflict deters investment, why would a capitalist want that?


True diversity means divergence instead of convergence, the latter is Stalinism, and if we can afford to keep alive animal diversity (endangered species) then we should also be able to afford to keep alive human diversity (languages, phenotypes, etc) simply by not coercing people into unnatural situations of multiculturalism as Americans did to the Indians, and as as multinational corporations are now doing to peaceful countries such as Poland, Sweden, and Ireland.First of all, America didn't introduce multiculturalism to the indians, we shipped them off to reservations as a seperate group.

Second, how is 'divergence' beneficial? How is it good that every small village in the Balkans feels the need to keep itself pure from outside influence?

Also, animal divergence didn't just happen one day. It occurs when an animal leaves the environment it was in (usually when said environment changes) and the animal has to adapt to change. Likewise, many people left Europe for a better environment, and were absorbed into America. They cease to be European, and within a generation they are something else entirely, many times losing all ties to the former homeland outside of food. Why do you feel that if someone moves to Ireland, or Poland, or Sweden, they won't assimilate to the culture they're in?

Lastly, are you worried your culture will be gone before you are?

Metternich
10th February 2009, 22:47
"Or do the strong have a natural right to dominate the weak?"

The rule of law dictates that no man has a right to abuse others. Hierarchy implies leaders and followers so we must first define your definition of 'dominate.'

Socialism dictates that the most conniving dominate all others. This was truth in Stalinist Russia as well as in Maoist China, both of which murdered multitudes of innocent people.

"People simply shouldn't think with a tribal mentality."

By all means, I do not wish to change your thinking. But there are many advantages to having an in-group, as traditional man was well aware of.
It seems that large kin-relations are beneficial for human psychological and spiritual development.
Check 'happiness and social networks' (I was not allowed to provide a link).


Divergence is a good thing (according to our worldview) because it is the natural state of man and fosters healthy in-group feelings of altruism, just as branches diverge from a tree trunk.

Convergence is created by the likes of Napoleon, Stalin, or George Soros (and others like him). It is made for the benefit of the few to wield power over the many, and to destroy their autonomy.

The issue with corporations is that they 'think,' that is make decisions on relatively short time horizons, needing to please shareholders. Therefore NAFTA seemed like a good idea, shifting jobs away from the US, and bringing more workers into the US, as it naturally would lead to greater profit margins for the said corporations, but in the long run they did not consider balkanization.

And regarding my culture, or any particular culture, I truly do (and I am not just saying this for rhetoric's sake) find beauty in the wonderful tapestry of languages, and cultures all over the world. Languages, cultures, and tribes are becoming more and more extinct every day, impoverishing all of us of the beautiful diversity of humanity (which is created by the principle of divergence).

trivas7
12th February 2009, 15:54
You sound like a LaRouchite racist asshole.

Metternich
13th February 2009, 01:17
You sound like a LaRouchite racist asshole.

Thank you, dear sir. I can only take such an intellectually stimulating response from a leftist as a compliment.

Raúl Duke
13th February 2009, 01:53
Nice choice of user name, you seem to be just as reactionary as that character was.
However, looks like history didn't go the way he wanted...


There was a time when every single province in Europe was home to a unique language, and a unique tribal identity.They still do in some parts of Europe, like Spain and Italy.


When mass wealth confiscation occurs, the very wealthy will try to hide their wealth and transfer it to other safe havens, but without a civilization of their own, the wealthy will have less and less options for potential growth, and without working protestants, there can be no protestant work ethic.The rich/elite needs the working class to maintain their position...of course they can't have there own civilization by themselves.



True diversity means divergence instead of convergence, the latter is Stalinism, and if we can afford to keep alive animal diversity (endangered species) then we should also be able to afford to keep alive human diversity (languages, phenotypes, etc) simply by not coercing people into unnatural situations of multiculturalism as Americans did to the Indians, and as as multinational corporations are now doing to peaceful countries such as Poland, Sweden, and Ireland.

This reminds me of something I read that was criticizing these similar positions.

This kind of view that we need to save separate cultures "from multiculturalism,etc" strikes me as something that some modern day fascist nationalists and/or reactionaries would agree with.

GPDP
13th February 2009, 03:15
Thank you, dear sir. I can only take such an intellectually stimulating response from a leftist as a compliment.

Haha, trivias is the resident right-wing troll.

Dumbass.

Metternich
13th February 2009, 04:11
This kind of view that we need to save separate cultures "from multiculturalism,etc" strikes me as something that some modern day fascist nationalists and/or reactionaries would agree with.

But the big question remains - why don't you agree with it, be it that confederalization would be a net aggregate for true socialism (be it that Francophone regions would go leftwards).

You must know that PC/cultural marxism has been highjacked by corporate elites that increase their profits at the expense of workers, using the dogma of PC.

Therethore confederalization of Europe (and other regions of the world) would be beneficial to all countries.

Switzerland would be capitalism, and right wing, yet Belgium would swing way way left.

You could move to one place, I could move to another.

Raúl Duke
13th February 2009, 05:04
I'm not disagreeing with the concept of confederation. I have not disagreed with it in any point.

You should know that "separating cultures" has more to do with anti-immigration (and other such things) then confederation.

Metternich
13th February 2009, 23:23
I'm not disagreeing with the concept of confederation. I have not disagreed with it in any point.

You should know that "separating cultures" has more to do with anti-immigration (and other such things) then confederation.

At least limiting it to the point where assimilation is possible would suffice.

But confederation implies voluntary, something that cannot be said about today's immigration policies.

Raúl Duke
14th February 2009, 06:24
Assimilation occurs even in our current situation.
I read that studies have shown that 2nd-3rd generation Mexican-Americans in Texas do not speak Spanish or have very little knowledge of it.
I lived in Miami and 2nd generation children of Latin-American immigrants are quite assimilated, despite multi-culturalism. They are more "americanized" in some respects and modes of thinking then me!
(I'm somewhat a 1st generation immigrant...from Puerto Rico to the U.S. but Puerto Rico is acquainted to U.S. culture and it also part of its territory.)
Some of the children (2nd-3rd gen) of the Cuban diaspora currently are also lacking Spanish knowledge and I bet they have very little knowledge of Cuban culture.

The fear that they "won't assimilate" seems to be unfounded IMO, although this argument is usually found in countries having an immigration flux and the argument is used to enforce stronger immigration controls or, at worst, fuel anti-immigrant sentiments/discrimination (whether de jure or de facto, etc).

Metternich
15th February 2009, 01:47
Assimilation occurs even in our current situation.
I read that studies have shown that 2nd-3rd generation Mexican-Americans in Texas do not speak Spanish or have very little knowledge of it.
I lived in Miami and 2nd generation children of Latin-American immigrants are quite assimilated, despite multi-culturalism. They are more "americanized" in some respects and modes of thinking then me!
(I'm somewhat a 1st generation immigrant...from Puerto Rico to the U.S. but Puerto Rico is acquainted to U.S. culture and it also part of its territory.)
Some of the children (2nd-3rd gen) of the Cuban diaspora currently are also lacking Spanish knowledge and I bet they have very little knowledge of Cuban culture.

The fear that they "won't assimilate" seems to be unfounded IMO, although this argument is usually found in countries having an immigration flux and the argument is used to enforce stronger immigration controls or, at worst, fuel anti-immigrant sentiments/discrimination (whether de jure or de facto, etc).

I can assure you that Moslems are fully fledged against any form of assimilation into Europe culture but are there strictly to bread and bread off of the welfare system. They do not want to become European and consider it an abomination to do so. They have given Europe a taste of 'honor killings,' female genital mutilation, and gang rape against women who don't wear the veil (including indiginous European women).

Regarding Cubans, I would imagine that the problem of religious difference being non-existent, and cultural difference being less as well, assimilation would be less of a problem.